The Right Way to Rotate Your Running Shoes

Carrie Tollefson: Hey, everybody. Welcome to the RunDot podcast. Today we're talking about building a run shoe rotation. How many shoes do we actually need? That is the million dollar question. So we want to talk about this. It's going to be a fun day. And we are joined today by Coach Brady Hoover. Brady is an ACSM certified personal trainer as well as a certified functional strength and conditioning coach, level two, that is. And he's a run DNA certified running gait analysis analyst. Oh, my gosh, that word always gets me. You are also an eight time Boston Marathon finisher and you have a PR of 2:48:40. You've been a run coach since 2016, coaching both runners and triathletes. So welcome to the show. I'm Carrie Tollefson, Olympian, broadcaster and your guide to the world of run.com. We treat this show like any good workout. We're going to start with the warmup question, settle into our main set conversation and then wind things down by having Coach Brady answer an audience question on the cooldown. Lots of good stuff today. And so I, like I say on my other podcast, which is called C Tolle Run, let's get after it.

Announcer: This is the RunDot podcast, the running show that brings you world class coaching with every conversation. Let's get started with today's warmup.

Carrie Tollefson: Well, hey, Brady, how you doing?

Brady Hoover: Oh, I'm excellent. I'm so excited to be here and talk all things running. I just love this sport.

Carrie Tollefson: I know, so do I. I think we could talk about all kinds of things, but today we're talking about run shoes, so we're going to have to stay on course. But for our warmup question today, I want to know what running shoes are you in right now? And I know you said you have a lot of them, so you might just pick one or a few more, but let's just talk about your rotation a little bit.

Brady Hoover: Oh, gosh. I got too many. Too many shoes to count. So many that I think I own more pairs of just running shoes than my wife has shoes. So it's a problem. Every time I see a clearance, I'm buying it. So right now I'm kind of rotating through the New Balance Rebel V4. Love that shoe. It was just on clearance because the V5 is coming out. I just picked up a pair of the Adidas Evo SLs. Enjoying those Adidas Supernova New Balance Pacers. I got the carbon plate in there for the speedier days. And then for racing, if I'm doing triathlon, it's the New Balance Elite v3. I've modified those for triathlon needs. And then the Adios Pro 4s, which I'm just loving right now. So, yeah, those are my main rotation at the moment.

Carrie Tollefson: Oh my goodness, that is a lot. Like, what do you have something for every day or do you just kind of go with the flow, how the body's feeling? How does that work?

Brady Hoover: Yeah, going with the flow and how the body's feeling. You know, I got the, like, I grabbed, I scooped up a pair of the Adidas and that kind of broke my running shoe rotation, the Evo SLs, the training shoe, because I just enjoyed them so much that every run I'm like, no, I just want, you know, I don't want to run in these. I, I, I want to, you know, just running the Adidas because I just love that shoe. And then I was up at our home up in Maine and I threw on a pair of old Rebel Rebel V Fours that I had purchased back in. It was April 2024 when they first came out and I forgot how much I love that shoe as well. So I was like, ah, here's my answer to get back to my shoe rotation is let me scoop up another pair of these, which I did not need. But you know, you're a runner yourself. It's just like you can't shoes especially.

Carrie Tollefson: I know, I know. Yeah. Well, I am a, I'm definitely a three stripe gal. I mean, they were so good to me during my professional career. They sponsored me my entire time. And then when I got pregnant, I had a couple more years, I think, on that contract. And then after that they helped transition me to Reebok for a little bit because they were together at the time. So then I did some work for Reebok, more like an early influencer, but I was still competing and still thinking about getting back to the sport. And then after the Reebok days, I've always had Adidas, sort of be that person or that company that will support me in any way. So I do wear mainly Adidas, but like you, I try to wear so many different kinds, tons of different models and I actually, I think I've been healthier for it. So my three right now, the Adidas Boston's, I love, I think they, I love that they're so light and they do have a little bit of, a little bit of arch support. So it's not like a total flat shoe. But I do like the Addi zero SLs, which is a little bit more of, I guess it has a Little more oomph to it. And then the Ultra Bus, Ultra Boost. Excuse me. I love them as well, but they are, they run a little short, so I have to go up in size a half a size of those. But yeah, I'm pretty much all over the place. And I do wear other brands, you know, when I'm at different events that are sponsored by other brands, then I'll run in those two. And I definitely think I've stayed healthier because of it.

Brady Hoover: Agreed. Yeah. I'm not partial to just New Balance and Adidas. It tends to be my go to because I, I have, I run with different run clubs and stuff, so I get a little bit of a discount, so that's where I go to. But you know, I've run on Asics, Hoka, quite a few pairs of Hokas. That's just, you know, what's, what's on the shelf right now in my rotation currently. Awesome.

Carrie Tollefson: Well, thanks for the warmup question. And we want to invite the audience to definitely chime in. So check out all of our social accounts, the RunDot social accounts, and we are curious to hear what shoes are you in right now as well. So let us know on our socials.

Announcer: Let's go.

Carrie Tollefson: All right, Are you ready for the main set?

Brady Hoover: I'm ready.

Carrie Tollefson: Okay, let's do it. All right. Some runners rock all of their training and racing in one single pair of shoes. And you and I have talked about this. We sort of have that closet full of them. So when you are trying to be a successful runner, do you recommend having a number of shoes or do you like to just have that one? And now we've sort of heard from you, but what do you recommend to your athletes?

Brady Hoover: So I definitely recommend a shoe rotation. I kind of broke my own rule when I got those EVO SLs for, you know, a couple of weeks. You know, it was just the excitement of it. Right. Motivation to train.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah.

Brady Hoover: But highly recommend because, you know, different shoes are like, it's like, it's like cross training for your feet. Like each, each shoe, depending on its like, heel, toe, drop, its stack height, can offer different benefits in changes to your, you know, not really your running gait or mechanics so much, but how those, how your muscles, ligaments, tendons are loaded so you're doing that same repetitive motion every once in a while. Like I'll get like a, you know, a cranky calf or cranky Achilles, and then I really can't run in like a six millimeter drop shoe. I need to step up to an 8 or a 10 as it's going to alleviate some of that stress so that I can still go out and do my runs. So I always recommend, you know, some sort of shoe rotation, at least two pairs. Now with the introduction of super shoes, some athletes will have three pairs, four pairs. It really depends on how often you're running and what your budget is. But definitely want to consider, you know, the benefits of having different shoes. You know, shoes can be tailored to different workouts. It's also going to increase the longevity of your running shoes because you're not just running one pair of shoes all the time. If I look at my, my kind of main three shoes, like the, the old, the oldest pair or the pair with the most amount of miles on it right now is the Evo SL, and they're, you know, approaching 200 miles, where my New Balance only have about 50 miles on them. My racing shoes only have a marathon on them. So it's not like you have to replace all of them at once. If you're, if you're smart about it, you can kind of rotate, you know, rotate your speedwork shoe in, and then when you get a lot of miles on that, you know, you're replacing that. Then you get a few more months maybe on your tempo trainers or long run shoe. So it's not like you're replacing them all the time. So, um, I, I like to say it will increase the longevity of your shoe.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah. So you really kind of recommend, though, like, three pairs. I mean, that's what I heard stand out the most. Like you have a lot, but you are obviously testing out things and seeing how things work for you and maybe even thinking about your athletes while you're in these different types of shoes. But do you think three is kind of the ideal number?

Brady Hoover: I'd say three. Three is a sweet spot, especially if you're running three times a week. It's like I can run a different pair of shoes every day. So, you know, we're, we're always going to have like, we're going to have our long run. You know, that's priority number one. If we're training for something, you know, half marathon or longer. So we have our long run. We have our long run. So you're going to want like a kind of a beefier, more padded shoe to, you know, save those legs a little bit. You're always going to have a speed work day. I call it track Tuesdays, where it's usually your faster workout of the week. It could be Mondays. It could be Wednesdays, but then you'll usually have a lighter, more responsive pair of shoes for those. Then you have your, you know, your recovery run, which that could be your long run shoe or my recovery run. That's where I like to, you know, just depends on how my feet are feeling. Like I enjoy the Evo SL and the New Balance Rebel as I mentioned, but like, every once in a while things will get cranky and I need something like the Super Adidas Supernova, that's got a 10 millimeter stack height to alleviate some of the stress of Achilles, to allow me to just like go out there comfortably run. So it's, it's good to have different weapons in there for your run and different reasons, but it's all really going to come down to like running mechanics and, and what's going to be right for you as well.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah, and I have heard you talk a lot about the heel stack. I mean, that was never really a thing when I was racing and because I've, I'm still in this running world, right. And I still know enough about shoes, but I don't really just throw that. How many, you know, millimeters the heel stack is. But that's becoming a thing. Like a lot of people know how many millimeters they're running in or if it's a zero drop or whatever.

Brady Hoover: Yeah, it's, it's. Yes. With the, with the advances and the different kinds of foams out there, the running companies, running companies are able to increase the stack heights while keeping the weight relatively the same. Like back when I started running, you know, running, I guess I was always a runner. I was a center mid or left midfielder, so I was a runner and I just didn't know it yet. And then 2000 came and I'm like, okay, how do I stay in shape? I, you know, I work so much, I can't play soccer anymore or, you know, it's just games on Saturday or Sunday kind of thing and no practice. I'm like, I got to stay in shape. So then I found out, just enjoyed running. You know, back then we would have, gosh, when I used to run in. I think they're still around today, like the New Balance 1080s, but they're, you know, the stack height was really big, but it was heavy. Now the 1080s, the stack height still has that same stack height, but they're a lot lighter and more comfortable. So I only do like long runs in them and sometimes like I would even feel the weight on the bottom of my foot, but then I Was saying, well, the reason I'm training in these now is it's going to make race day easier. When I'm running my, like, racing flats, which was like a zero drop or a 2 millimeter drop shoe, probably what you used to race in New Balance, what, 1400s or 1500s is what I would race it and my feet would just be pulling me at the end of a marathon. But that's what we did.

Carrie Tollefson: So wild. Like, we laugh about that now. Like, my husband pulled out an old pair of racing flats. I don't even know what they were. They're Adidas. And it, you know, they're so thin, like the cushion underneath it. And he was thinking he was going to wear them. I'm like, they don't wear those anymore. Like, nobody wears those things anymore. Get them out of the closet. They're like 15 years old. Like, they are retro. You know, wear them with your jeans. Let's talk a little bit about a little bit about that. Like marketing shoes now. You know, when you talk to any shoe rep or you go into a shoe store or you're looking online, they're talking about a lot of different things. How doesn't somebody that's kind of new into it or even like me, someone that, I mean, I'm an Olympic athlete, I love to run, but I really don't. I don't want to be talking all the technicalities of shoes all the time. I just want to get a good pair and go running them. So what would you tell an athlete to look for? And maybe like, just in common terms, not someone that's, you know, been in the sport for years like you have.

Brady Hoover: Yeah. So first thing, when you go, when you go in a better buy a pair of running shoes. Going to a specialty store, especially if you're new in the sport, you know, I'm here in New England, up in Newburyport, Massachusetts. We have, you know, marathon sports right here in town. And, you know, there's always an employee, you know, on staff that's in the store that can take a look at your, you know, I'm not going to say, like running. Well, they're looking at your running gait. They're not doing an analysis. They're just seeing how you move to, you know, are you pronating? Are you supinating? Are you heel striking? You know, how are you pushing off the ground? And they can recommend it. Right. Pair of shoes for you. And once, you know, and kind of pick their brain about, about it a little bit too, and say, you know, why are you recommending this? Oh, you're pronating. So we were suggesting a stability shoe. Well then you can go online and you can restart researching stability shoes. You can go to different manufacturers, you know, somebody new starting out. I don't know if I would recommend a lower, lower drop shoe. Like a 4 millimeter drop I might recommend, or I know I would Recommend Like a 6 to an 8 millimeter because it's kind of that neutral. Whereas I don't know if their cast and Achilles can handle that kind of load, especially depending on what they're training for. So distance, you know, comes to into mind when suggesting a pair of running shoes and, you know, just history. If they're new to running, you know, they go into a four millimeter drop shoe. It's, it's a lot of stress, you know, on the foot, on Achilles, the calf. So going somewhere kind of in the middle is going to allow for some of those adaptations to take place. And then you'll know, do I need to go to a higher drop or a lower drop? So really getting a, you know, a professional to look at you. I mentioned marathon sports, but I think, is it, is it roadrunner sports, they're kind of nationwide is another national running sport. Fleet feet. We talked about Millennium Running earlier. They have a store, so any of those specialty stores, hey, you may pay $10 more for the pair of shoes that you' going there for a service. I say that's crucial, especially if you're just not sure what you should be running in.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah. And I think the big thing. Well, first of all, pronation is when you roll in. Supination is when you roll out a neutral shoe. You know, we, there's cushion, there's a stability shoe. All that's kind of what, when I sold shoes, that's what we talked about. Are you pronator? Are you supinator? Do you want more cushion? Do you need more, you know, do you need more of a, a shoe that doesn't move? Do you want a flexible shoe? Now it is. They're going to talk to you about what the heel is doing in a shoe before you even get in the shoe. So that's something that we should, I guess, learn. Get with the times, peeps. Like I need to get with the times to talk about the heel stack.

Brady Hoover: Yes. Like they, they deal with like a lot of novice runners. They're starting out. So a lot of the terms that I maybe threw out there might fly over some people's heads, but they're really going to, you know, bring it down and you could even ask a running coach that has, you know, some sort of background and gait gait analysis and they can take a look. And I love when my runners come to me and say, hey, I'm thinking about a new pair of shoes. I'm going to replace my, you know, if I suggest the Rebel before, I kind of want to try a different brand. Great. I'm going to find all, you know, I'm going to go across the board. I'm going to find a HOKA that fits that family. I'm going to find an Asics shoe that fits that family of Skechers. You know, I'm going to go right down the line. I love it when I get asked that question. Maybe, maybe spend too much time doing it because I could geek out on this all day.

Carrie Tollefson: Did you ever work in a running shoe store?

Brady Hoover: I didn't, no.

Carrie Tollefson: Oh, they are missing out. They needed you.

Brady Hoover: I love to learn.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah, that's great. I mean, and that's the thing, I think as you go through this sport, you really do learn a lot about your body and what your feet do on the run. And it's not necessarily what they do when they're, when you're out walking or when you're just standing around. Like your shoes, your feet do weird things when they're trying to keep you up and you're trying to propel you forward. So you do have to sort of test it out. I love that some of the running shoe stores will allow you to take the shoes home, go for a run or two and if they do not feel right, bring them back in because they want you healthy, they don't want you getting hurt in their shoes. So I know that a lot of the shoes in Minnesota will do that or the shoe stores in Minnesota will do that. Okay.

Brady Hoover: So company shoes will do that. Road runner sports, marathon sports, they have like a 30 day guarantee. I mean, assuming that you don't put a ton of miles in them and really beat them up, you do a couple runs and you say, yeah, I'm not really liking this. They won't necessarily refund your credit card, but they're going to give you a store credit. If you paid $150 for that shoe, going to give you a credit of $150 towards, you know, another shoe. So it's, it's just awesome. They really stand behind their fitness.

Carrie Tollefson: Okay, well, I'm going to dig into this a little bit more because you've kind of like gone over a lot of things. But I want to Kind of reiterate some of the things that we've talked about already. So forgive me if I ask a couple things over and over again, but you're, you're teaching me here, so I might ask the same question twice. But how do you know as a coach, how do you advise and even as an athlete yourself, how do you know which pair to grab when you're heading out on a run? Like a lot of times right now I am not doing a lot of training that is geared towards anything. I'm actually, you know, just getting out the door and trying to find a different loop or, you know, just kind of going through the motions and having some fun with my running right now. There's not a lot of structure to it, so I don't think it really necessarily matters to me. However, I do think it's important for me to continue to mix up my shoes. I have just stayed healthy with it, so I'm going to keep doing that. But what do you recommend to your athletes as they decide which shoe to wear, if they are, you know, one to buy multiple pairs of shoes?

Brady Hoover: Yeah, so it depends, like what's the, what's the purpose of the workout that they're doing that day? Is it a speed work? Is it track Tuesdays? They're going to want something that's, you know, lighter weight, that's more responsive, that has, you know, has a good cushion. If they're on a longer run, their tempo run, long run, maybe something that's got a little bit higher of a stack height, a little bit more padding under the foot. It really, you know, it really depends on, on those couple of things. If we're talking like a two shoe rotation, I think, I think the sweet spot's really three. But it depends. You know, I'm training for a marathon, right. So I have three shoes. I'm gonna, I'm gonna put a ton of miles on those shoes. Where other runners, they might be just training for 5Ks, I would recommend, you know, two shoe rotation there. Unless they might have something that they want to race in as well, then that, that's that, that third pair of shoes. But I wouldn't really count that as part of the rotation, if you, if you will.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah. And if they go for an evening walk or something like that. Cause some people, some people train twice a day, some people don't. But they add in their mileage from walking at night or they're taking their dogs or whatever out on a walk. Do you recommend going in that pair of running shoes or do you like me save some of my last season running shoes, and then that's where I kind of play in. I go out and play wiffle ball now, or I, you know, I go to a game in them, but I still feel like I can still be in them and they're not going to hurt me. So how do you, what do you say? Would you say, tell an athlete who kind of has a. A walk in the evening and put them in their running shoes or have a totally different pair.

Brady Hoover: Oh, have a totally different pair of shoes. For walking. For walking. You know, it could be like those old, you know, I'll typically put about 300 to 500 miles on a pair of shoes.

Carrie Tollefson: Running, you'll run 3 to 500 in a pair of shoes.

Brady Hoover: Okay. And that's, you know, through a rotation. So it usually takes me four, six months to get through that many miles on one pair of shoes. After I've put that many miles on a pair of shoes, I'll go out and, yeah, walk in them, hike in them. They become my yard shoe. Things like that. If they were going to be, say, they know when I would do two workouts a day, I would do my son, say, Tuesday. I'd be on the track in the morning, and then I'd have a slow, long, you know, slow run in the evening. So maybe it was an hour hard workout in the morning. 40 minutes, slow and easy. That's not walking in the afternoon, I'd be putting on the different pair of shoes. I'd be putting on my long run pair of shoes for that slow recovery run. I don't need that responsive light trainer that's got a little bit less cushion. Like, I want my legs to feel good. I want to, you know, finish that run and feel like I didn't even really go for another run. You know, you feel fresh.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah, for sure. I mean, there's, there's times where I'm like, why are my knees kind of achy? Or why am I a little bit, you know, not feeling as springy? And it is funny how sometimes you put on a pair of shoes and a new pair and you're like, well, there we go. That's why. You know, maybe they just broke down a little bit quicker or, I don't know. Do you think that the temperature of what we're running in affects our shoes? Like, do they wear out more in the summer than they do in the winter or vice versa?

Brady Hoover: Yeah, great question. You, you alluded to a couple of different things. What was that?

Carrie Tollefson: First, I know you know, I'm all over the place. I just been thinking and thinking and thinking. I just say it all at once.

Brady Hoover: Oh, yeah. I call them the phantom pains, right? You're. You're out for a run and you're like. I'm feeling this little twinge, like, just under my kneecap. This is so strange. Oh, I know when I felt this before, it's usually when my shoes are approaching 300 miles, and then I open up my Strava, and I use Strava just for, you know, all my stuff goes there, but I'm only using it really to track my shoes. And I. I look at my Strava and I go, oh, Gosh, I have 280 miles on these shoes.

Carrie Tollefson: Ah, no wonder.

Brady Hoover: 300.0It's time to replace this, you know, speedwork, you know, this. This more lightweight, responsive shoe and replace it. It's funny how our body can give us, like, those little signs. I say, you know, listen for those little. Or as Matt Summer says, listen for the little whispers before your body yells. Yeah, great advice. So I highly recommend, you know, tracking your miles. Garmin has a tracker on there. I just. I just found the Strava one more seamless. It's like I open up my thing, and then it asks me a couple of, you know, workout pops up, and I can just select the pair of shoes I'm running in. And then every time I log or run, I know how many miles are on that pair of shoes. Sometimes I don't look at the mileage, but, you know, when my body tells me those Phantom 8 that you mentioned, it's usually approaching or 500 miles. I found with the new foams out there, I'm not getting as many miles before I need to replace that. Because the foams are much lighter, they break down a little quicker. But I'm also pretty on my shoes. Some people might be a little bit not so hard on their shoes. They might be able to push their mileage a little bit longer. And then you mentioned the shoes breaking down finally in the summer in the heat and humidity. Actually, different heats and humidity can break down those foams a little bit quicker.

Carrie Tollefson: Brady, how long did you say a shoe lasts on the shelf?

Brady Hoover: Oh, they say three years from the manufacturer date, and then others will say six months. Well, I say, you know, your. Your best bet is, you know, think about a year from the manufacturer, the year they get on that shelf.

Carrie Tollefson: Okay?

Brady Hoover: You'll want to run those miles in, and we'll get into that a little bit later.

Carrie Tollefson: I think I mean, I have shoes in my basement, Brady, that are probably five years old because sometimes I get shoes from places that, you know, have given us a pair and I just haven't gotten to them. So do you say not to run in those then if they are past one to three years old?

Brady Hoover: Oh great. That's a great question. So not necessarily don't run in them. Right. They're still, they're still a brand new sneaker. But just don't expect them to last, you know, the three to 500 miles. Really. Listen, look at those little aches and pains that you mentioned that you'll sometimes feel. And then you throw on a new pair of shoes or you grab the other pair of shoes out of your shoe rotation that have less miles on them and you're like, oh, that little, that little dull ache that I felt in the bottom of my patella, it's not there. Oh, it's probably time to replace that pair of shoes. Like, you're just going to want to look for those little cues. You may not notice that they're not as responsive like the new foams today. They kind of compress and then expand so they give you a little bit of a pop. Not, not talking about a carbon, carbon plated shoe at the moment, but fuel cell by New Balance that, that foam compresses and it kind of springs. So they're a little bit bouncy. So you might notice, I mean, if you're in tune with that. Not all runners are in tune like we are as to like how something feels on our foot. They're just, they're, you know, kind of putting the miles. But if you're really paying attention to those things, those are some things that you'll, you'll notice that, oh, the first time I put these shoes on, I remember them being really responsive, really kind of prepared, pulling me forward and I'm not really feeling so much. You know, if, if this pairs of shoes have been sitting in the basement for five years. Well, he might notice that after 100, 150 miles rather than 300.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah, for sure. What are your, your thoughts on? I mean I, we've been talking about you being in a lot of Adidas and in New Balance recently. Sounds like you've tried out Asics and all the brands too. But what do you say to athletes that really are like, nope, I am a three stripe gal or no, I am all about the Asics shoes or Brooks or whoever it is. Like, do you tell people to think outside the box or are you okay with Them liking a certain brand, but they definitely need to kind of, I think, go with the times and see what, how the, the models have changed over the years.

Brady Hoover: Yeah, so every, every brand, I mean, the shoe manufacturers are so good nowadays that they have pretty much every stylish shoe do. They're all competing amongst one another that you don't have to necessarily have different brands or be loyal to a specific brand. You can kind of spread yourself out. Some people I, I, I have a coach, a runner that he's just got wide feet. So New Balance is all that works with them because they have like the, you know, in the box it might be size 11E, right? That E represents, it's a, it's a really wide toe box and that's what, you know, this runner needs. So whereas ASICS is known for like their, you know, their arch support and really, really having a nice tight fit, you know, through your arches and, you know, the center part of your foot. So, you know, some manufacturers have those little kind of, I'm not going to call, I'm going to say quirks, but they're not really quirks. They're just like things that are, you know, specific. But if you do write running and say, I know triathletes and they, they only want to run in Hokas. Right. There is nothing wrong with running in, you know, know, two different pairs of Hokas. Right. Because each one, when you're shopping around, you want to consider, okay, this one's a little bit lighter weight. There's not as much cushion under the foot. This is going to be my speed work shoe. Maybe it's a 6 millimeter drop between heel and toe. Not, we're not talking stack height. We're talking about the pitch of the shoe from where your heel sits to where your foot sits. You know, that's different, that's a little bit different than, you know, say, stack height of how much under the foot. So then you could go with another pair of say, Hokas that are a 10 millimeter heel toe offset, a little bit of stress on the Achilles and calves. I say it's always nice to have something with a little higher heel toe offset to have in that rotation. Because if you're running, you know, if you're here, if they just a runner, right, and you're running four to five times a week, at some point your calves, your Achilles are going to get a little cranky. It's nice to have another tool in your toolbox to kind of pull into that rotation and switch things up. And it May not be your shoot preferred. Like I like as close to a 4 millimeter drop as I can get nice on those long runs or those recovery runs to have something where my muscles aren't. My muscles, my tendons, my ligaments aren't stressed in that way, like the Achilles area as they would be in say a lower stack height shoe or a lower, sorry, stack height heel, toe drop shoe. So things to consider.

Carrie Tollefson: We are such runner nerds, Brady. It's crazy. I love it, I really do. So if an athlete though, okay, you've been talking about all these different kinds and how we both have these different kinds. But if an athlete really only has a budget for one type of shoe, one that they would race in, do the workouts in, do those long runs in, do those easy runs, what would you recommend? Is this even like a question that I dare ask? Because it is a hard one to answer.

Brady Hoover: It is a very hard one to answer. But, you know, some people are, you know, don't have the budget for two pairs of shoes and that is totally fine. We're recommending, we're telling you the benefits of having at least two pairs in the shoe rotation. But if you can only have one that can kind of do it all, you know, something that's going to have a good amount of foam that you can take on long run. So like a decent sized stack height, something that has maybe a 6 millimeter to an 8 millimeter drop. Obviously you want to have a. Someone in an employee in a store that we mentioned earlier. Millennium running, marathon sports, Road runner sports. Like, look at your gait mechanics to be really recommend because maybe you can't go in something like a. I always like to recommend, like the Novablast. I think it's, yeah, the Novablast 4, which is a great shoe that can kind of do it all. It's very lightweight, it's a comfortable trainer, it's got a good stack height. The foam's light, it compresses, you could race in it. It's light enough that you can race in. It's not a stability shoe, but we call it a stability neutral because it's got a wide enough base that it is relatively stable. The New Balance Rebel 4 also is one of those shoes, though the Rebel 4 has a lower heel toe offset. So definitely things to consider. If you can only get one pair of shoes that does it all, that it has enough of a stack height and foam underneath to really compress and save the legs, that it's light enough that you can race in and do those fast workouts and there's nothing wrong with that for sure.

Carrie Tollefson: It's fascinating though. A couple last questions though. First, this is a silly one, but I need a clean shoe. Do you ever wash your shoes?

Brady Hoover: I don't, I don't. But I have a pair of shoes that I won't go out in the rain with so that they're, they're cleaner. Pair of shoes or my race shoes. Right. Well, I'll race in those in the rain. But yeah, those racing shoes, if I, I need that clean shoe. Well, there, there it is.

Carrie Tollefson: See, I wash my shoes all the time. I don't dry them, but I will wash them. And I don't know if that's a bad thing, but I definitely will throw them in the wash, you know, on a lights or you know, low spin cycle or whatever you say and get them clean. So sorry, coach, I go against, I go against your logic. I washed my shoes, peeps, and also.

Brady Hoover: 2 tons spray on stuff. Yeah.

Carrie Tollefson: Oh, well, yeah, don't I just put them in the wash. I take my Nel's Falfa or however you say that bar. It's like Scandinavian bar of soap that gets all of the stains you could ever imagine in life, anything you can think of. And I use that on the muddy parts of my shoe and I scrub it, throw it in the wash for just a little bit and I air dry them and voila, they're perfect. Nice. Yeah, but maybe it's not the best thing for the foam. So I'm not trying to say I know what I'm doing either.

Brady Hoover: Break it down. But still can't the rain in the dirt, especially if we're running dirt, there's salt and stuff on there. I mean, ultimately, like your body's going to tell you when it's, when it's time to replace a pair of shoes. If you're listening to it, something doesn't quite seem right. Always wise when you have that question to just go throw in another pair of shoes and see if it goes away. If it does, it's time for that new pair of shoes.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah, for sure. Super shoes. Let's talk a little bit about those. You know, we talked about if someone is only going to buy one pair of shoes do and they've heard about these super shoes. Like really nowadays, how much can you get in a super shoe? Like how many miles can you get in there? And also, do you really recommend super shoes for people that are racing and trying to run really fast?

Brady Hoover: Yeah. So super shoes. That's a good. It's a great question. I love them.

Carrie Tollefson: I have been raced in them that I know of.

Brady Hoover: Have you ever put a pair on your feet?

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah, but I really haven't done much work in them to see. I mean, I guess the Bostons that I'm wearing the. I think I have like the Boston 13s or something. Do they have like a little bit of some kind of carbon rod but not a full on. It's not like a full on racer.

Brady Hoover: I have to check. They could have another.

Carrie Tollefson: I don't know if they. I don't think it's a. Yeah, I don't think it's a labeled super shoe. I think it's more of a trainer. But that would be as close to one as I've gotten, I think.

Brady Hoover: Yeah. So that carbon, it really, you know, there's videos on YouTube and stuff. You can watch people kind of bend the shoe a little bit and then let go and it's like a pogo pogo stick. It just goes. And then they, you know, they do a regular shoe and it, you know, only moves forward a couple of inches where the super shoe really pops forward. I remember I threw on the first pair of Nike 4% and I run with power. So I was like, well, let me keep all effort the same and see if like if this is all about the hype. And I threw on a pair of super shoes. Now I'm a midfoot striker, not a heel striker. So that, that can make a difference. Right. You could be a heel toucher, heel striker. If you're heel striking, which you know you're over striding, we call it putting on the brakes. Yeah. Hands down, don't get a super shoe until you work with like a ring gate specialist and address that to be more of like a heel toucher or a midfoot striker. Because it's actually because you run risk of injury, you run a higher risk of injury. Another thing, I mean there's not a ton of science out there yet on the super shoes. But I was talking to Bobby McGee about a year ago, it was February 2024, and I was picking his brain about super shoes and stuff. And he says, you know, the one thing that they're, they're seeing is a lot of like stress fractures on the foot and some Achilles issues with those shoes with runners that are running in them too often. And I kind of always had this. I was like, okay, well, carbon, it's, it's, it's doing some of the work that my foot otherwise would. And with my strength and conditioning background, I kind of thought, hmm, if, if you're, I'm running in these shoes, it's, it's doing some of the work for me. So what's happening? Like my tendons, my ligaments are not getting the same stresses they otherwise would in another running shoe. So it's not really atrophying. But in a way, you know, those, those tendons and ligaments are getting less strong, if you will, and opening up the athlete to, you know, some sort of stress fracture or something like that. That's what like the early data is telling us. And then if somebody is, you know, also running them too often, it, it kind of shifts that load. So rather than the load being really at say the Achilles area, that load's got to go somewhere. It's, it's up in the, it's up towards the hip and in the femur, which is, which is great, right? Those muscles are, you know, those muscles are stronger. But also if somebody's running in them too often, well, that's something that their mechanics are also not used to. So that's opening up them to an overuse injury up in that area. So it's like, you got to be careful with them. They're super shoes. They're great right out of the box. They're not something that you really have to break in. I would recommend doing like a lot if you're racing a marathon, like getting a, getting a 16 mile run in, in them to get a feel for them and then kind of putting them away until race week and then, you know, on two of the run, two of your short runs, like those speedier runs, if you will, where we're kind of progressing to race pace, like using those right before the race. And then if you have, you know, this is just my personal advice, then if you've run in them, you know, say in the last 30 days, you really don't need that break in or getting used to, like everybody's pretty familiar with it. Maybe just one of those runs because you're spending a lot of money there, 200 to $300. Unless you go with like the new Adidas ones, which are around $500. Those ones I think break down after 50 miles because of the they use. So it's like you really don't want to put a ton of miles in them and really save them for those races, you know, running them just enough to be comfortable and used to them and remember how they work, but not really running in them once a week for your speed days or anything. Like that, um, if it's been, you know, two months time. Yeah. Break them out for one speed work workout just to remember how they feel and then put em away until you're closer to your race. Um, I just don't wanna see, I, I see runners get hurt and I don't like, I don't like to see that. Cause that means, you know, eventually they might think about leaving the sport and it's like, well, they were just in the wrong shoe. We could have solved this problem or the mechanics, you know, they could have changed, change slightly and that kept them in this sport. So super shoe, I say is the last resort. Definitely. If you're a heel striker, they're out because a heel striker you're, you're striking the ground and you're putting on the brakes. And like I mentioned before, it's changing the lever system so that stress has to go somewhere. So it's actually going up into the hip, which is, you know, already a cause for an increase in injury. If you're over striding like that, then you throw on a super shoe on top of that and it just kind of magnifies what's going on.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah, I mean it's interesting to hear that everyone kind of has to like test them a little bit to see because you know, even at the elite side when I'm doing all the commentary, there are athletes that come up to me and they're like, they've either had to figure out and they're lucky a lot of times the brands will help them. You know, they'll put an upper on a different bottom or you know, upper versus lower, all these, they can kind of make shoes for them that are legal. But also there are some athletes like an Emily Sisson that took a long time to figure out what shoe worked for her with New Balance. Like she didn't do the super shoes for many years. I think she's slowly getting into them. But she's had to figure out how to do that to stay healthy and also to react to the super shoe. Some people, they, what do they call them, super reactors or you know, non reactors. So it is interesting. So the super shoe again is the carbon plated shoe that is all the rage now set. And anyone that's in them is usually setting these new records. And you know, the whole sport has changed because, because of them.

Brady Hoover: Yeah. And I, I noticed a couple things when I threw them on and I did that test like early on when the 4% first came out and, and I noticed I can't tell you the exact numbers anymore, but that was several years ago. But I noticed that my stride length did increase at the same effort. Um, I think I, I guess at a, I think it was a 6:50. That was my marathon pace at the time. So I went out marathon pace in my New Balance 1400s. And, you know, that was maybe 275 watts, let's say. Then I threw the, you know, stride power meter on the 4%. And at that same effort, you know, I was doing a 6, I'm gonna say a 6:44 or 6:43 at the same effort. And I noticed that my stride length increased, but also my vertical oscillation went from like 7 centimeters to 9 centimeters meters, you know, keeping all at the same. So, yeah, they are, they are faster if, you know, if your mechanics allow you to run in them, they're very pricey. So again, don't, you know, go bank. Do they give you a little. They give you a little bit of race day edge, as one of my athletes said. Oh, yeah. When he first ran his first half marathon, he said, oh, it hid my bunk pretty well because they do want to prepare you forward. But I say that's like a last resort. It's not your one and, you know, one pair of shoes that you train in all the time. It's. It's like that pair of shoes that you, you put away and you only break out for races and, you know, every now and again.

Carrie Tollefson: So if you're almost to the age of 50 and you still want to run really fast and break your PRs and you haven't run in a super shoe, do you say there's still a chance to set a new PR in the super shoe?

Brady Hoover: Yes, there's still a chance, you know, get a pair. I mean, they are just evolving so much, you know, and each, each brand has their own, you know, kind of make of them that I think the latest, like, kind of that look out of this world are the Puma Nitros. They are. They reminded me when I put those on at Boston this year to just kind of try them out because I was curious about them. It was like I threw on my first pair of super shoes all over again. I was like, oh, my gosh. There's like, these things weigh 6 ounces, I think the weight was. And I stood in them and I, I, I felt like my wife in high heels. Uh, and my one foot into the, you know, the sales rep. And of course he came to answer this. I said, I see an issue here. If somebody's A heel toucher, meaning like they're not over striding, but they're touching and they're rolling into the ball of their foot. They throw on a pair of the Puma nitros. My, my fear was that they're going to be a midfoot striker. Well, they haven't conditioned their muscles through this, so that's, you know, where somebody could get into an overuse injury. So just things to think about as hopping around for shoes. And they didn't you guys come up with a trainer that's similar to this so an athlete can train in it if they're a heel toucher. I'm lucky enough to be a midfoot striker, so I, you know, no problem. But if I was a heel toucher, I would no longer touch. So I wouldn't recommend that shoe to just everybody.

Carrie Tollefson: Yeah, I definitely think you need to try. There's a pair I need to go and look now at the Adidas pair that I wore when I ran my last marathon. They might have been an early super shoe that I just wasn't paying much attention to. But my calves, for the first time, I've never had my calves go crazy on the, at the end of a marathon before and they really did. And now that could have been hydration or fueling all the things, right? Not necessarily the shoe, but yeah, I just, I think you're so spot on that we have to try all the different pairs and even look at underneath what the shoe is actually doing. I know there's a number of brands that have sort of wide space in between the toes and in between your arch and the toe. And I know Paola Radcliff has even had to figure out which pair of Nike ones she's going to wear because her toe, she's got an issue with one of her toes. It's actually why she had to stop running competitively. But one of the pairs really bothered that. So like, yeah, you just all have to try shoes and run. Specialty shoe stores are the best place to do it. You can't just look online and read about and be like, oh, that's the pair for me. You really have to go try them on.

Brady Hoover: Yeah, totally agree. You mentioned that the rubber on the bottom, you know, that's, that's where like in their shoe studies, these companies have done, you know, kind of wear testing that. Where do most athletes wear out the shoe? That's where we want to take, you know, keep the rubber and we want to remove it, say from, you know, the inside of the heel. We're going to remove it, and it's not even going to be there because the athletes that are running in the shoe that it's designed for, you know, that part of their foot's not even touching the ground. So, like, we can reduce the weight of the shoe. Right. It's all about the weight now by removing this piece of the rubber, it doesn't really need to be there because the athletes aren't wearing on there. So very important to. Yeah, have somebody look at your run mechanics to make that recommendation if you're. If you're new to the sport, kind of don't really know what shoe should I be running in. Super helpful to grasp, you know, a professional's opinion on that.

Carrie Tollefson: Well, super thankful for all the knowledge that you have for it, and I'm really excited for your upcoming season. It looks like you're going after some big goals and obviously always thinking about the little things they say, Right. Like, it's. The training is the hard part, and that's what we, you know, spend so much time thinking about and doing. But it's the little things. And when you think of a pair of shoes, that's really not such a little thing. It's a big thing. And we need to make sure we're. We're, you know, fueling our body properly, not just with food and hydration, but also with the gear that we have on. So thank you for all of that.

Brady Hoover: Yeah. The important part is getting through the training. When people say, you know, my first Boston, I remember being interviewed by the news. Are you nervous to run 26.2 miles? I was like, no, this is the finish line. Like, the hard work was the, you know, the hundreds of miles that I put in to get to this point and stay healthy. That is the real part of the. Is the sport is getting to that starting line healthy. So a good pair of shoes, the right pair of shoes, a good rotation is the way to go.

Carrie Tollefson: All right, you ready for the cool down?

Brady Hoover: Absolutely. Let's do this. Let's see what the audience has for a question today.

Carrie Tollefson: Okay. This one's coming all the way from Colorado, and Julie has asked, if you've missed multiple training runs, should you just jump back in as if nothing has been missed, or should you do a new time trial to reset your training?

Brady Hoover: That is a whole can of worms. Okay, so it depends, right? I'm going to say it depends. Like, yeah, how much training are we talking? Are we talking like, I was just sick for a couple of days and I missed three days of training? And I'm getting back in, into it, or, you know, I went rogue and went on vacation and traveled abroad and I missed a month of training. You know, that, that would, you know, that would have a different, different answer. So I'll kind of go over, over that. If it's just, just a couple of days, chances are you could probably get right back into it, you know, like, you haven't missed a beat. I wouldn't go crazy trying to make up workouts because it was just a couple of days, right? If you're training for a half marathon, missing two or three workouts in a row is just like a small dip in the big bucket of, you know, all the miles that you're doing to train for the race. So it's not gonna have a huge detrimental impact. Um, you know, your body will tell you you'll go out for a run and, you know, an easy, you know, start off. Like if you in the warmup, you know, your body's pushing back a little bit and you're trying to do your speed workout, you know, chances are it's probably not the day for it. Just, you know, go for the duration. Like to say that the training plan and the hours that we're putting in, the duration of the training, even if we're going zone two, you know, running easy for every single workout, it's going to get us to that finish line. The intensity is going to get us there faster. So your body's going to be, you know, the big determination there. You know, if it's been, say a week, chances are you could probably jump right back into the training at the same intensity. But again, like, listen to the body. Maybe you're set up for, you know, it's been a week and you're set up by four. Four by one mile repeats at your 5K pace. You know, go for that first repeat. If the body pushes back, say, well, you know, four is probably not a good idea. I'm gonna go, I'm gonna try, you know, I think I can do one more. And if one more kind of depletes, you stop there. Now, if it's been a month or something like that, that's where, you know, you really gotta probably consult with somebody. That's my last long run was, you know, 20 miles and now my next, my or, sorry, say my last long run was 16 miles. And now my training plan is telling me to run 22 a month later. Should I go out and run that 22? Chances are not. You're gonna probably need some help. You Bridge the gap to ramp you back up to that point. You know, our body can only handle so much stress at a time. If you're training on RunDot, typically it's a three week build and, you know, three week where the intensity or the volume or a combination of both increases each week. Somewhere between 10 and 20% each week. That's either intensity, volume, or a combination of both. And then we deload. So when you're getting back on track, those are things to say, okay, where do we left off? Where do we need to start? And we can only really add 10, you know, save 10 to 15% and kind of ramp up that way to get back to it. So, yeah, it's kind of a can of worms, depending on how much training was missed. But if it's, you know, just a couple of days or a week, I wouldn't sweat it too much. If it's, you know, even two weeks, yeah, you're probably gonna have to start off a little easy, maybe pull back the long run mileage a little bit. But if it's been three weeks or more, that's where it might be best to consult with, you know, a coach or professional that could advise you how to get back on the track. So like I said, I don't want to see anyone get injured in this sport.

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